NAE in SLC

See this link about a meeting of Evangelical leaders this March in Salt Lake City. Bloomberg, Hazen  and Johnson will present a case for positive dialogue with Mormons.

http://www.nae.net/news/534-press-release-evangelical-leaders-meet-in-utah

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About Tim

Evangelical Christian living in Southern California. I live with my wife and whatever foster children happen to be in our home at this moment. I love photography, baseball, movies and I'm fascinated by Mormonism.

20 thoughts on “NAE in SLC

  1. I think there ought always be positive dialogue with Mormons.

    But one should never back down in those dialogues from sharing the fact that Jesus is God and that He loves and died for real sinners, and that is all that is needful for our righteousness.

    Thanks for the link.

  2. From the link:
    “We hope this time of dialogue with LDS leaders will deepen our understanding of the Mormon faith . . .,” said Leith Anderson, NAE President. “For the sake of Christ and his kingdom, we seek to represent biblical evangelicalism to those who wouldn’t hear or know. We also look for common ground on issues where we can work together.”

    Praise God!

    Hi theoldadam. When you say “Jesus is God,” do you mean Jesus is that which binds Father, Son, and Holy Spirit together into one, or do you mean Jesus is the Father? If it’s the former, I agree 100%.

  3. Actually, Jesus is God. The Father, Son and Holy Spirit are one God.

    That is why Jesus said, “if you have seen me, then you have seen the Father”, and “I and the father are one”.

    The trinity is orthodox Christian doctrine, and I happen to believe it.

  4. I believe the Trinity doctrine also.
    I believe the Mormon Church also teaches the concept of it, although they use different words.
    I’ve talked about it before, as you probably know. I don’t want to be a broken record and repeat myself when there’s no point in it, but I believe dialogue with Mormons (the post’s topic) could be vastly improved if we understood each other better on the issue of the Trinity.

    The word “God” is not always used with the same exact meaning in the Bible. This is one thing that makes the subject sooo tricky.
    The Bible does say Jesus is God—and of course he is—but in some places the word “God” refers to the person of the Father, not just the essence that Father, Son & Holy Spirit share. For example, in John 17:3 where Jesus is praying to the Father, he says “Now this is eternal life: that they may know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.”

    Have you ever thought about that? I believe this verse is explained by recognizing that within the Trinity, the Son submits to the Father (1 Cor. 15:27-28) but the Father does not submit to anyone (Heb 6:13).

  5. No one can properly explain the Trinity and exactly how it works. But that Jesus was fully man, and fully God is enough that He has authority to forgive and judge.

    When we start to lower the standing of Jesus as compared to the Father, I think we can get into trouble.

    So I don’t think there is any value in going there.

    Christ Jesus, and Christ Jesus alone, is enough.

    My 2 cents.

  6. You got more than 2 cents in there, buddy! That Jesus, as God, has authority to forgive and judge is of infinite worth!
    Have a nice day.

  7. Cal’s got something. If the Father and the Son are identical/co-equal, why does Jesus constantly submit to the will of the father?

  8. Because he and the Father are one. So how could he go against the will of the Father?

    Trying to figure out the trinity is a dubious undertaking. I take it on faith that they are one God.

  9. Kullervo! Somebody got it! Time for a festival!

    I believe they are equal (John 5:18) in that they are full of the same stuff, same spirit, same essence, same nature.
    But they are two persons, as the Trinity doctrine states.

    And look at this(!): the word “God” is often used for the person of the Father:

    John 5:18: “he [Jesus] was calling God his own Father, making himself equal with God.”

    1 Corinthians 8:6: “yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live.”

    In John 20:17 Jesus said to Mary, “I am returning to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.”

    The next one requires a back-flip: In John 17:3 Jesus, praying to the Father, says, “. . . that they may know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.”

    Incredible, uh? The Bible is a treasure chest of surprises.

  10. So is 1 Corinthians 8:6 saying that the Father is God, but that Jesus is the Lord, which is something different than a God?

    That’s a serious question.

  11. Kullervo! Somebody got it! Time for a festival!

    Don’t break out the beads and party hats, Cal. The question was purely rhetorical, as I am still not actually a Christian.

  12. Kullervo: “I am still not actually a Christian.”

    At least you know you aren’t. A step in the right direction.
    Another good thing about it is that you don’t have the religious spirits that Christians tend to have, that is, false traditions and the resulting religious activity that is void of God.

    The bad thing about it is . . . well, I don’t want to scare you.

    ——–
    Eric, yes it’s a question for major league theologians or anyone who presses into Jesus like he was the best thing that ever happened.

  13. At least you know you aren’t. A step in the right direction.

    How? When I say I am not Christian, I don’t mean it in some kind of humble, vulnerable broken-hearted contrite-spirited way of the seeker.

    I mean, there’s a big world religion called “Christianity” which I have looked into pretty extensively, and at the end of the day I am simply not a part of it, because I do not believe in the unique divinity or atoning sacrifice of Jesus Christ.

    Another good thing about it is that you don’t have the religious spirits that Christians tend to have, that is, false traditions and the resulting religious activity that is void of God.

    You know I actually worship pagan gods and dead rock stars, right?

    The bad thing about it is . . . well, I don’t want to scare you.

    Don’t worry. You really, really won’t.

  14. Kullervo said, “You know I actually worship pagan gods and dead rock stars, right?”

    Does your worship fall under the category of the occult? I think I remember reading that you consult tarot cards.

    I don’t know much about tarot cards but I’ve been told that they enable you to come into contact with evil spirits. Is that right? (Of course, if you are contacting evil spirits, you may not know you are. The devil is a deceiver and if you do not have Christ in you, you are easy prey for him.)

    Are you aware that there is a real devil with demons under him who hate you with a perfect hate?

  15. Does your worship fall under the category of the occult?

    Sure, but only if your does.

    I think I remember reading that you consult tarot cards.

    Indeed.

    I don’t know much about tarot cards but I’ve been told that they enable you to come into contact with evil spirits. Is that right?

    I sincerely doubt it.

    (Of course, if you are contacting evil spirits, you may not know you are. The devil is a deceiver and if you do not have Christ in you, you are easy prey for him.)

    Granted, you also might be contacting “evil spirits” when you pray. The Devil is a deceiver after all.

    Are you aware that there is a real devil with demons under him who hate you with a perfect hate?

    Are you aware that there is a real Zeus who is angry when you fail to give help to beggars and strangers?

    Are you aware that there is a real Dionysus who demands that you give in to passion and intoxication or else be utterly devoured by it?

    Are you aware that there is a real Ares who expects you to act like a man?

    Okay then.

  16. “you also might be contacting ‘evil spirits’ when you pray. The Devil is a deceiver after all.”

    I know I’m not contacting evil spirits because praying and the answers to my prayers increase my peace, happiness, hope, satisfaction, love for people, and sense of being loved.

    The devil has no love. He gets you to do things that are temporarily fun but set you on a downhill track, like getting high on drugs or extra-marital sex which slowly destroys your enjoyment of sex and attracts other undesirable side effects.

    (I think we got off topic. Tim may show up to scold us.)

  17. What if the Devil is tricking you into a false, counterfeit sense of peace, happiness, hope, satisfaction, love for people, and sense of being loved?

  18. Furthermore, what if “consulting tarot cards” give me a sense of peace, happiness, hope, satisfaction, love for people, and sense of being loved?

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